In this chapter, Weaver discusses errors that writers, especially young children, make in their writing.Students may learn grammar rules through observation, and when the learner is ready, they errors can be fixed.Many common errors made by young students deals with their overgeneralization of a grammar rule, such as adding –ed to the end of every verb to present something in the past.Children can only master one thing at a time, so teachers need to be aware of this and not expect them to master a topic all at once.
Weaver gives advice to help teachers deal with error that students make in their writing.When children begin to spell, they use only a few letters to convey their thoughts because they are just starting to learn to write.As they learn how to identify more sounds, they learn to add these sounds as letters to the words they are writing.It is important that teachers help them to hear the sounds rather than to focus on spelling something right all the time.The students will naturally start putting the sounds they hear in their writing.Weaver also talks about how the addition of sentence structures can also interfere with correct grammar.She describes an instance where after teaching her students about participial phrases, they were unable to correctly punctuate their sentences. Instead of condemning the students for failure to include already known skills in their writing, she allowed for error and worked with students to punctuate more conventionally.
One of the most developed topics in this chapter is the teacher’s “hunt for errors”.Weaver talks the teachers who are so involved in checking for errors and the impact it has on their students.These students come to hate writing because all the teachers look for are errors instead of their ideas.She gives teachers advice on how to look at students’ individual styles rather than the conventions of grammar because many professional writers don’t use traditional grammar in their writing.She also presents other methods to help students in perfecting their writing skills.During the writing process, it is important to allow students to have reading time, have time for all phases of the writing process, have a model for how to do something, and have editing workshops available. Teachers should have mini-lessons taught to the entire class, have mini-conferences one-on-one with the student, have the chance to teach editing techniques, and have the students peer-edit.After the final draft has been submitted, teachers can choose to do nothing about the errors that are in the writing or only focus on certain kinds of errors. An option while grading is to simply put a checkmark by the line where the error occurs and have the student find the error.Also, if an error occurs in an exorbitant amount, teachers should comment and suggest a way to fix it.Weaver makes it a point to say that it is important to guide students rather than correcting every error that students make in their writing.
For discussion, what approach will you use when you edit students' work? Are there any ideas of Weaver's that you disagree with? Concerning style versus conventional grammar, on what will you focus your grading and why?
I believe that a teacher must use a variety of methods to teach writing. Writing is one of the least popular subjects to work on for a elementary or secondary student. Therefore, a teacher has to use a variety of lesson plans for writing; especially when class is held every day. I also think that a teacher should encourage topics and ideas and then work toward correcting grammar. If a student writes on a topic that is interesting in their eyes, then that student is much more likely to work harder on the paper.
I believe that it is important to teach prpoer grammar, but I also believe that it has its place. In the first draft, students should focus on getting their ideas on paper in any form necessary. Then, the teacher can either help the students proofread or have them peer-edit each others' work. A teacher should only count off for grammatical errors in the final draft. In this draft, grammar and spelling errors should be minimal because they have been filtered out through the editing process.
I think we should look for grammar errors in the first draft, but not actually count points off for them. The earlier we catch the errors in a draft, the earlier we can fix them and focus on content, MLA/APA, etc. I always thought maybe grading in different colors would help. Having red writing for errors all over an essay is really intimidating (and pretty depressing too!) for a student. Maybe if errors were corrected in like pink ink and then GOOD things about the paper were pointed out in a different color, students would be able to look at their paper and go, "Oh, well maybe it wasn't all that bad!" We can still help them correct errors in that way, but they won't feel as bad about having an entire paper covered in one color.
I liked what Jacob said about letting them pick topics to write about that they find interesting. I think that's a great idea, as I at least think it's a lot easier to write about something I like. :)
I believe that grammar must be corrected, but only in certain circumstances. I agree with what the previous comments say, but I would add to it that I think, in certain types of writing, grammar does not need to be corrected at all. If the writing is not in a formal essay, and involves jotting down a personal feeling about a topic or telling a personal experience, something along those lines, I don't believe grammar is at all the point. However, in a research paper, students should definitely be penalized. When teaching writing, I would try to make it enjoyable. Every person has a voice, and I believe that once they find it, writing can become one of their favorite tools.
I also believe that grammar should be corrected in the first draft so that students can see where they made mistakes and how such mistakes could effect the final draft. However, I do not believe that points should be taken off the first draft for grammar errors. If the student chooses to keep the grammatical errors after the first draft then I feel that points should be taken off of the final draft.
Deciding when to grade grammar can seem a bit complicated sometimes. When writing a paper I do believe, like most of the others who have posted so far, that taking points of for incorrect grammar should be done at the level of the final draft. When a student has errors in their first draft, I think that is ok. A first draft is rough, and it should really just focus on ideas not so much grammar. When the first draft is edited their errors should be marked, but not have points deducted. When they turn in their final draft those errors should have been corrected, and that is why I feel it is ok to take points away then.
I agree with the fact that grammar should be checked in a first draft, but points should not be counted off. In the final draft, of course, grammar should be checked. However, the ideas and points should be the actual focus of the grading. Grading papers can be frustrating, and finding errors can be easier than helping to develop possible promising points. It is up to the teacher to find a common ground between these two things.
I think that it is very important to take into consideration the feelings of the students when grading grammar. I for one have a bad habit of picking up a peers paper and just start marking away, handing the paper back all marked, up and saying good paper...but. I think that it is, indeed, very important to read the paper and really understand what it is saying, as well as checking for errors. It can be difficult, but to continuously point out all of a students errors and giving no positive feedback can be a hindrance to the student's chance at successful writing.
I think I would try and use multiple techniques for helping my students edit their work. I think I would first have the students turn in their papers as a first draft and try and make a few corrections on just the grammar, not the whole context of the work. But when they turn in that first draft to me, I would have the children pair off and do peer editing for the context and flow. I would also look at the context of the writing and make sure that the students are on the right track, but I think that students learn more from their own errors, then from me finding them and fixing them. I do not agree with Weavers suggestion for teachers to choose not to do anything about the errors that students make. I think the errors need to be address when they happen and then the student can learn from it. I think I would grade my students on their own style rather than conventional grammar. I think if I can understand what the student is trying to say and if he or she is on target with the subject of the writing, and then I think the grade should reflect that.
I don't think that there is one correct editing teachnique. I think I will use the peer-editing for rough drafts. I think this will give students some grammar practice that will actually make an impact on a peer's grade. I also like checking the sentence where there is an error. This allows the student to know there is an error, but he/she has to use his/her grammar skills to find it. I think it is also a good idea to highlight (if there is one) the major problem the writer is having. This will allow he/she to work on it and not focus so much on smaller mistakes. Although I feel grammar is very important, I also think what the students write is very important. I will grade grammar and content for my students' writings.
I believe that it is a really good idea to take in account the style the student is producing through the writing even if the grammar is not completely correct. I think being creative is as important as the textbook structure, so they should be guided into the corrections, and the teacher should make sure that the student is aware of the rules that they may be breaking. First drafts of a paper should have lots of red ink to point out the mistakes, but I will use a different color of ink (perhaps midnight blue?) to show the students what they are doing well to build their confidence.
The idea of guiding rather than correcting is important. This allows teachers to help students find correct answers on their own rather than have proper grammar forced down their throats. This constructivist approach gives the students a sense of accomplishment when they discover what they did wrong and helps them retain it better so that the mistake will be avoided in future writing. Also, it can help keep students from hating the subject and resenting the teacher. All of these factors are important and beneficial to the teaching process. However, I will say that while teaching grammar is a process that students cannot be expected to grasp all at once, it seems wrong not to show students what they have done wrong simply because the lesson is focusing on other areas. Certainly, allowances can be made such as not letting these other errors affect grades, but one must not allow students to believe that their grammar was perfect just because they managed to avoid certain errors. Correct everything, but only focus on and deduct points for errors made regarding current or recent topics.
i agree with weaver on the point that many conventional writers do not use standard grammar. Therefore, i find it most beneficial to develop a students voice and individual writing style. Teachers that stress perfection of an outlined cookie cutter writing style are merely endorsing socialist conformity. The most effective and developmental method for writing is giving students topics of interest and aiding them in conveying their ideas.
One of my English professors, whom I have had for 3 semesters, does something with our papers that I haven't had any other teach do: he prints out a short paragraph that focuses on the ideas we used in our topics. I find this to be extremely helpful. It lets me know which of my ideas were strong, which I should have developed more, etc. On the paper itself, he makes punctuation and grammar corrections, so I am still aware of mistakes I make, but that extra paragraph about my ideas is something I always look forward to reading. This is what I want to do with my students writing. I believe it is important to correct grammar mistakes, but it is equally important to comment on a student's ideas. A simple "good job" or "needs improvement" is not helpful to students, but taking the few extra minutes to show you actually read a student's writing will make a difference
I think I would look for and correct grammar and spelling errors in the first draft but i wouldn't take off points. I agree that first drafts are used for the students to get their ideas down . In the final draft, however, i would definately take points off for grammar and spelling errors. The trouble with this approach could be most students use spell check to check their papers, but spell check is not an absolute. It can be wrong sometimes.
15 comments:
I believe that a teacher must use a variety of methods to teach writing. Writing is one of the least popular subjects to work on for a elementary or secondary student. Therefore, a teacher has to use a variety of lesson plans for writing; especially when class is held every day. I also think that a teacher should encourage topics and ideas and then work toward correcting grammar. If a student writes on a topic that is interesting in their eyes, then that student is much more likely to work harder on the paper.
I believe that it is important to teach prpoer grammar, but I also believe that it has its place. In the first draft, students should focus on getting their ideas on paper in any form necessary. Then, the teacher can either help the students proofread or have them peer-edit each others' work. A teacher should only count off for grammatical errors in the final draft. In this draft, grammar and spelling errors should be minimal because they have been filtered out through the editing process.
I think we should look for grammar errors in the first draft, but not actually count points off for them. The earlier we catch the errors in a draft, the earlier we can fix them and focus on content, MLA/APA, etc. I always thought maybe grading in different colors would help. Having red writing for errors all over an essay is really intimidating (and pretty depressing too!) for a student. Maybe if errors were corrected in like pink ink and then GOOD things about the paper were pointed out in a different color, students would be able to look at their paper and go, "Oh, well maybe it wasn't all that bad!" We can still help them correct errors in that way, but they won't feel as bad about having an entire paper covered in one color.
I liked what Jacob said about letting them pick topics to write about that they find interesting. I think that's a great idea, as I at least think it's a lot easier to write about something I like. :)
I believe that grammar must be corrected, but only in certain circumstances. I agree with what the previous comments say, but I would add to it that I think, in certain types of writing, grammar does not need to be corrected at all. If the writing is not in a formal essay, and involves jotting down a personal feeling about a topic or telling a personal experience, something along those lines, I don't believe grammar is at all the point. However, in a research paper, students should definitely be penalized. When teaching writing, I would try to make it enjoyable. Every person has a voice, and I believe that once they find it, writing can become one of their favorite tools.
I also believe that grammar should be corrected in the first draft so that students can see where they made mistakes and how such mistakes could effect the final draft. However, I do not believe that points should be taken off the first draft for grammar errors. If the student chooses to keep the grammatical errors after the first draft then I feel that points should be taken off of the final draft.
Deciding when to grade grammar can seem a bit complicated sometimes. When writing a paper I do believe, like most of the others who have posted so far, that taking points of for incorrect grammar should be done at the level of the final draft. When a student has errors in their first draft, I think that is ok. A first draft is rough, and it should really just focus on ideas not so much grammar. When the first draft is edited their errors should be marked, but not have points deducted. When they turn in their final draft those errors should have been corrected, and that is why I feel it is ok to take points away then.
I agree with the fact that grammar should be checked in a first draft, but points should not be counted off. In the final draft, of course, grammar should be checked. However, the ideas and points should be the actual focus of the grading.
Grading papers can be frustrating, and finding errors can be easier than helping to develop possible promising points. It is up to the teacher to find a common ground between these two things.
I think that it is very important to take into consideration the feelings of the students when grading grammar. I for one have a bad habit of picking up a peers paper and just start marking away, handing the paper back all marked, up and saying good paper...but. I think that it is, indeed, very important to read the paper and really understand what it is saying, as well as checking for errors. It can be difficult, but to continuously point out all of a students errors and giving no positive feedback can be a hindrance to the student's chance at successful writing.
I think I would try and use multiple techniques for helping my students edit their work. I think I would first have the students turn in their papers as a first draft and try and make a few corrections on just the grammar, not the whole context of the work. But when they turn in that first draft to me, I would have the children pair off and do peer editing for the context and flow. I would also look at the context of the writing and make sure that the students are on the right track, but I think that students learn more from their own errors, then from me finding them and fixing them. I do not agree with Weavers suggestion for teachers to choose not to do anything about the errors that students make. I think the errors need to be address when they happen and then the student can learn from it. I think I would grade my students on their own style rather than conventional grammar. I think if I can understand what the student is trying to say and if he or she is on target with the subject of the writing, and then I think the grade should reflect that.
I don't think that there is one correct editing teachnique. I think I will use the peer-editing for rough drafts. I think this will give students some grammar practice that will actually make an impact on a peer's grade. I also like checking the sentence where there is an error. This allows the student to know there is an error, but he/she has to use his/her grammar skills to find it. I think it is also a good idea to highlight (if there is one) the major problem the writer is having. This will allow he/she to work on it and not focus so much on smaller mistakes. Although I feel grammar is very important, I also think what the students write is very important. I will grade grammar and content for my students' writings.
I believe that it is a really good idea to take in account the style the student is producing through the writing even if the grammar is not completely correct. I think being creative is as important as the textbook structure, so they should be guided into the corrections, and the teacher should make sure that the student is aware of the rules that they may be breaking. First drafts of a paper should have lots of red ink to point out the mistakes, but I will use a different color of ink (perhaps midnight blue?) to show the students what they are doing well to build their confidence.
The idea of guiding rather than correcting is important. This allows teachers to help students find correct answers on their own rather than have proper grammar forced down their throats. This constructivist approach gives the students a sense of accomplishment when they discover what they did wrong and helps them retain it better so that the mistake will be avoided in future writing. Also, it can help keep students from hating the subject and resenting the teacher. All of these factors are important and beneficial to the teaching process.
However, I will say that while teaching grammar is a process that students cannot be expected to grasp all at once, it seems wrong not to show students what they have done wrong simply because the lesson is focusing on other areas. Certainly, allowances can be made such as not letting these other errors affect grades, but one must not allow students to believe that their grammar was perfect just because they managed to avoid certain errors. Correct everything, but only focus on and deduct points for errors made regarding current or recent topics.
i agree with weaver on the point that many conventional writers do not use standard grammar. Therefore, i find it most beneficial to develop a students voice and individual writing style. Teachers that stress perfection of an outlined cookie cutter writing style are merely endorsing socialist conformity. The most effective and developmental method for writing is giving students topics of interest and aiding them in conveying their ideas.
One of my English professors, whom I have had for 3 semesters, does something with our papers that I haven't had any other teach do: he prints out a short paragraph that focuses on the ideas we used in our topics. I find this to be extremely helpful. It lets me know which of my ideas were strong, which I should have developed more, etc. On the paper itself, he makes punctuation and grammar corrections, so I am still aware of mistakes I make, but that extra paragraph about my ideas is something I always look forward to reading. This is what I want to do with my students writing. I believe it is important to correct grammar mistakes, but it is equally important to comment on a student's ideas. A simple "good job" or "needs improvement" is not helpful to students, but taking the few extra minutes to show you actually read a student's writing will make a difference
I think I would look for and correct grammar and spelling errors in the first draft but i wouldn't take off points. I agree that first drafts are used for the students to get their ideas down . In the final draft, however, i would definately take points off for grammar and spelling errors. The trouble with this approach could be most students use spell check to check their papers, but spell check is not an absolute. It can be wrong sometimes.
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